Possible property purchase & lawyers

[Matty]

Hi.

Thought I would post on this forum as this area has some relevance to my question. Looking for some advice on possible property purchase.

Last week whilst in Spain I viewed modern property of about 25 years old in a rural location. The property is ok with a good price. The rural estate agent advised that a couple of outbuildings which are also modern on the fully high fenced plot were not on the docs for the property, can't be added at this time due to issue with the locations unapproved general plan and worst case scenario these building may be refused permission and need to be removed. To me if these buildings had to be removed it is no loss as they are just brick shells. Given that these outbuildings shared similar characteristics to the others on the plot I would hazard a guess they were all built at the same time but were left off the docs for a reason.

Now roll on a week and my Torrevieja legal rep now tells me the plot size the agent listed for the property doesn't match the property docs. The plot size in the docs is actually smaller than the land fenced off. It's substantial permanent 6ft high fencing, metal posts in concrete and all so not exactly a subtle perhaps land grab when someone wasn't looking.

The agent said coastal lawyers don't understand rural property transactions and its not an issue.

I assume I am only incurring finding these building or plot issues because the owner selling is the original owner. Had I been the prospective 3rd owner these issues would have been found out by some poor sod before me and perhaps or perhaps not sorted by them.

On the face of it the owner is selling land he doesn't own but that he looks after as his own, and the agent is happy to market it knowing full well they have overstated the plot size. I suppose I could argue they selling me short for the price.

Out of curiousity checking the internet and the property is listed with several agents with varying plot sizes and even varying build sizes so it all seems hit and miss.

Obviously the consquences are someone may come knocking and ask for their land back at some point in the future.

I think I know the answer but just wanting to run it by people who may have had possible similar experiences with lawyers. Should I expect a rural lawyer to be more relaxed than a coastal lawyer when there are discrepancies in plot sizes on rural sales? Maybe a rural lawyer has a mañana attitude.

Thanks in advance of any views, Matty.

[freddo]

I would leave it alone and find another property

[Matty]

Thank's for your reply it supports my view overriding view of the situation.

[Bee]

Conveyancing is Conveyancing whether in the town or the country the same rules apply. A solicitor can only convey what is in the land registry. The Communidad Valenciana has a cut off of 15yrs for improvements which don't have planning permission. I forget what year it was introduced. I am sure any improvements or additions would still have to be added to your portfolio with proper maps and architects drawings. If you wouldn't buy it in your own home country then don't buy it in Spain.

Bee

[aviator]

It seems to me that there are two separate issues involved with your prospective purchase:

1. Selling you land to which the current owner does not have title.

2. Buildings on the property for which there is no approval by the appropriate authority.

It might be possible to get an architect to certify that the buildings were completed before August 2010 and the authority had not objected to them by 2014 so a certificate of antiquity could be obtained under Valencian Community regulations. However, item (1) above is an absolute 'red light' in my opinion.

[Matty]

Bee - totally understand and agree conveyancing is conveyancing. Seems like the principles of conveyancing in the country however may be, how can I put it, slightly massaged to meet certain individuals' objectives.

Aviator - agree with what you say. Digged further deeper and it looks like there had been some horse trading property versus land over the years over a few glasses of vino without legalising any of it.

Anyway i've now walked away from looking at property in that area and disconnected from that estate agent. Can't help but thinking had I used the lawyer recommend by the agent none of the issues with the property would have been highlighted and the sale would most likely had proceeded uneventfully.